'Big Short' Investor Explains How the AI Bubble Will Burst
Steve Eisman, the 'Big Short' investor, breaks down the AI bubble, revealing concentration risks and the true financial state of major AI players.
Steve Eisman, known for his prescient identification of market bubbles, including the 2008 housing crisis, has expressed significant concerns regarding the current artificial intelligence (AI) landscape. In a recent discussion, Eisman highlighted two primary areas of risk: extreme concentration and a fundamental lack of sustainable competitive advantages, or "moats," within the AI industry.
Concentration Risk in the AI Ecosystem
Eisman points to Nvidia as a key indicator of this concentration. While Nvidia reported impressive revenue growth of 110%, a deeper dive into their filings reveals a critical dependency: 70% of their accounts receivable, as of July, originated from just five customers.
This dependency extends to the major cloud providers – Google, Meta, Amazon, Microsoft, and Oracle. Eisman states that 70% of these hyperscalers' AI revenue, which constitutes approximately 25% to 30% of their total cloud revenue, is derived solely from Anthropic and OpenAI. He emphasizes that if either of these two AI companies falters, the entire chain, from chip manufacturers like Nvidia to the hyperscalers, could face significant disruption.
Oracle's financial performance further illustrates this point. The company reported a substantial increase in its Orderão (RPO), or backlog, from 400 billion in a single quarter. Subsequent analysis suggested that 50% of this RPO was attributed to OpenAI. Eisman notes that Oracle's current valuation of over $600 billion still relies heavily on OpenAI, a company that is reportedly losing substantial amounts of money.
The Financial Strain of AI Development
The financial models of leading AI companies like OpenAI and Anthropic are a significant concern for Eisman. He describes them as "bleeding money." OpenAI, for instance, reported 12 billion. During this same three-month period, OpenAI's revenue increased by 3 billion. In contrast, Anthropic's revenue grew by over 100% in the same quarter, indicating it is the stronger entity of the two, though still operating at a loss.
The funding for these AI ventures is not primarily coming from venture capital. Instead, major technology companies such as Amazon, Google, Microsoft, and Nvidia, along with SoftBank, are investing heavily by taking equity stakes. Eisman likens this financial structure to a circular arrangement, where money and commitments flow in one direction, and then commitments flow back. He suggests that this circularity can hold as long as Anthropic and OpenAI continue to grow rapidly and attract further investment. However, a significant misstep by either company could lead to a withdrawal of funds and a collapse of the chain.
The Absence of Moats in AI
Beyond concentration risk, Eisman argues that the AI industry, despite hundreds of billions of dollars invested, lacks sustainable competitive advantages, or "moats." He contrasts this with companies like Google, which historically held a dominant position in search due to its superior product and lack of viable alternatives.
Eisman identifies several factors contributing to this lack of moats:
- Token Maximization Ending: Initially, companies like OpenAI and Anthropic significantly undercharged for their services. As they raised prices to cover their costs, businesses became more cost-conscious. This led to a decline in "token maximization," where employees were mandated to use AI extensively. Companies like Uber reportedly exhausted their AI budgets rapidly, and others spent substantial sums without clear ROI.
- Rise of Open-Weight Models: The increasing availability and capability of open-weight models, such as Kimmy K3, are providing cost-effective alternatives. Businesses are now opting for these models for less critical tasks, reserving premium services like OpenAI and Anthropic for highly important functions.
- Lack of Customer Loyalty: In the LLM (Large Language Model) space, there is little customer loyalty. If a superior LLM emerges, software developers are likely to switch. This contrasts with deeply embedded enterprise software, such as that offered by Salesforce or ServiceNow, where switching costs are prohibitively high.
The "AI is Ending the World" Narrative as a Strategy
Eisman posits that the widespread narrative of AI posing an existential threat to the world may be a manufactured hysteria. He suggests that companies are nervous about the end of token maximization, the lack of moats, and the competitive threat from Chinese open-weight models. By promoting the idea of an AI apocalypse, these companies may be attempting to influence government regulation. Their goal, according to Eisman, is to manipulate regulatory outcomes to create a duopoly, where government intervention, such as barring Chinese AI models, would effectively create the moats they currently lack.
He points to statements from Anthropic CEO Dario Amodei and Elon Musk advocating for a slowdown in AI development. Eisman finds these calls disingenuous, particularly if the companies are simultaneously pursuing IPOs. He argues that genuine concern for safety would lead to postponing such financial events.
Hyperscalers and the Power Problem
While hyperscalers like Microsoft, Amazon, and Google possess moats due to their scale and the immense cost of building data centers, Eisman notes a critical weakness: their current cash flow has been significantly impacted by AI investments. Some are even experiencing negative cash flow. Google, for example, recently raised $85 billion in equity capital, a move Eisman finds remarkable for a company that historically did not need to raise capital.
The immense demand for AI is also creating a significant "power problem" in the United States. Eisman agrees with Elon Musk's assessment that while China faces a chip problem, the U.S. faces a more fundamental challenge with power infrastructure. The demand for electricity to power data centers is substantial, potentially increasing U.S. electricity consumption by 3% to 4% annually, equivalent to adding two large cities' worth of demand. Companies like GE Vernova, which manufactures gas turbines and electrical equipment essential for power generation, are experiencing a surge in orders, with backlogs extending beyond 2030.
Investment Strategy: Picks and Shovels
When considering investments in the AI space, Eisman advises a "picks and shovels" approach, focusing on companies that provide the infrastructure and tools for AI development rather than the AI software providers themselves. He would avoid investing directly in LLM providers due to the lack of moats and is wary of hyperscalers due to their current cash flow issues.
Instead, Eisman suggests looking at companies like:
- Nvidia: For its role in providing AI chips.
- Micron: A memory chip manufacturer.
- GE Vernova: For its power generation equipment.
- Arista Networks and Cisco: For networking infrastructure.
- Eaton: An electrification company.
He also expresses skepticism about the broader software industry, particularly SaaS (Software as a Service), citing the potential disruption from agentic AI that can perform tasks currently handled by various online platforms. However, he believes deeply embedded enterprise software is likely to remain resilient.
Broader Market Concerns
Eisman touches upon other market concerns, including the U.S. national debt, which he believes is less of an immediate threat due to the U.S. dollar's reserve currency status and the role of U.S. Treasuries in the global financial system. Regarding interest rates, he views the 10-year Treasury yield as a critical indicator, suggesting that a sustained level above 5% could trigger a market correction.
He also dismisses the idea of precious metals or Bitcoin as productive investments, likening them to assets that "sit there and do nothing." He finds Bitcoin's inverse correlation to its own thesis particularly perplexing, suggesting it functions primarily as a speculative asset.
Ultimately, Eisman's analysis of the AI landscape is one of caution, emphasizing the significant risks associated with concentration and the absence of durable competitive advantages, while acknowledging the potential for companies providing the underlying infrastructure to benefit.
Introduction and The 'Big Short' Connection
The interview opens by establishing Steve Eisman's identity and his reputation for spotting financial bubbles, drawing parallels to 'The Big Short' and setting the stage for a discussion on the AI industry's potential vulnerabilities.
- Steve Eisman, known from 'The Big Short,' is interviewed.
- The discussion centers on the potential bursting of the AI bubble.
- Eisman humorously acknowledges his 'Big Short' fame, suggesting it will be on his tombstone.
- He notes the massive capital expenditure required for AI infrastructure, like data centers.
Concentration Risk in AI: Nvidia and Hyperscalers
Eisman details the significant concentration risk within the AI ecosystem, focusing on Nvidia's customer dependency and the hyperscalers' heavy reliance on just two AI companies, Anthropic and OpenAI, for a substantial portion of their cloud revenue.
- Eisman highlights concentration risk, using an analogy of a software company with few customers.
- Nvidia reported 110% revenue growth, but 70% of its accounts receivable came from five customers.
- Hyperscalers (Google, Meta, Amazon, Microsoft, Oracle) derive 25-30% of their total cloud revenue from Anthropic and OpenAI.
- Oracle's RPO (backlog) saw a massive jump, with 50% attributed to OpenAI.
The Financials of OpenAI and Anthropic
The financial health of key AI players, OpenAI and Anthropic, is scrutinized. Eisman reveals that both are incurring massive losses, with OpenAI's costs outpacing its revenue growth, raising concerns about their long-term viability.
- OpenAI had 12 billion.
- OpenAI's costs increased by 1 billion in three months.
- Anthropic's revenue grew over 100% in three months, indicating it's currently the stronger company.
- Both companies are losing significant amounts of money ('bleeding money').
Funding Sources and Circularity Concerns
Eisman explains that the substantial investments in AI companies are largely coming from major tech players, creating a potentially circular financial system. He likens this structure to the complex financial products that fueled the 2008 crisis.
- The primary funding for AI companies like OpenAI and Anthropic comes from investments by tech giants (Amazon, Google, Microsoft, Nvidia) and SoftBank, not just venture capital.
- This creates a circular funding dynamic where large companies invest in AI firms that then spend heavily on those same companies' infrastructure (chips, cloud services).
- Eisman draws parallels to the CDO structures in 'The Big Short,' noting similarities in financial engineering.
The 'No Moat' Argument and Hysteria Manufacturing
A core argument is that the AI industry lacks defensible moats, leading companies to artificially inflate demand and hype. Eisman posits that the existential risk narrative is a ploy to influence regulation and secure market dominance.
- Eisman argues the AI industry lacks sustainable competitive advantages ('moats').
- Companies are 'token maxing' (overcharging for AI services) and raising prices, leading customers to seek cheaper, open-weight models.
- He suggests the 'AI will end the world' narrative is manufactured hysteria by companies fearing the end of token maxing and competition from Chinese models.
- The goal is to prompt government regulation that creates artificial moats (e.g., banning foreign AI models).
The Power Problem and Infrastructure Challenges
The discussion shifts to the critical bottleneck of power infrastructure. Eisman elaborates on the US's power generation challenges, the surge in demand from data centers, and the booming business for companies like GE Vernova that supply essential power generation equipment.
- Elon Musk highlighted that while China has a chip problem, the US has a power problem.
- Building data centers requires immense power infrastructure, which is a physical and long-term challenge.
- Companies like GE Vernova, which produces gas turbines for power generation, are seeing massive order backlogs.
- The demand for electricity from AI data centers is significantly increasing US electricity consumption.
Investment Strategies: Picks and Shovels
Eisman outlines his investment philosophy for the AI era, advocating for a 'picks and shovels' strategy. He suggests investing in the infrastructure providers rather than the end-product AI companies, citing the lack of moats and financial strain on hyperscalers.
- Eisman advises against investing directly in LLM providers due to the lack of moats.
- He is wary of hyperscalers due to their depleted cash flow from AI investments.
- Recommended investments are 'picks and shovels': companies supplying the infrastructure, such as Nvidia, Micron, GE Vernova, Arista Networks, Cisco, and Eaton.
- Software companies with deeply embedded enterprise products are considered safer than those easily disrupted by AI agents.
The 'Real Eisman Playbook' and Investment Analysis
Eisman shares insights into his personal investment methodology, emphasizing a narrative-driven yet rational approach. He also promotes his podcast, 'The Real Eisman Playbook,' as a resource for understanding market analysis and specific industries.
- Eisman's investment approach is 'story-oriented' but rational, avoiding grossly overvalued assets.
- He doesn't require a moat but likes companies with real growth tailwinds.
- Red flags include management selling stock and cyclical companies.
- His podcast, 'The Real Eisman Playbook,' offers interviews and market recaps, with a paid tier for deeper analysis like bank valuation.
US Debt, Interest Rates, and Market Stability
The conversation touches upon macroeconomic concerns, with Eisman downplaying the immediate risk of a US debt spiral while emphasizing the importance of long-term interest rates as a market indicator. He also comments on government attempts to manage debt costs.
- Eisman is not overly concerned about a US debt spiral due to the dollar's reserve currency status and Treasuries' role in the global financial system.
- He believes long-term rates (like the 10-year Treasury yield) are more critical for the market than short-term Fed rates.
- A 10-year yield above 5% could trigger a market correction.
- He views government efforts to manipulate long-term rates as a response to the interest expense burden.
Precious Metals, Bitcoin, and Geographic Investment
Eisman expresses skepticism towards non-productive assets like precious metals and Bitcoin, questioning their investment theses. He reaffirms his focus on the US market, finding sufficient opportunities domestically.
- Eisman has never owned precious metals, viewing them as non-productive assets similar to Warren Buffett's perspective.
- He considers Bitcoin 'worse' than precious metals, citing its inverse trading behavior against its own thesis of hedging against fiat debasement.
- He focuses solely on the US stock market, having found international investing complex and lacking clear advantages during his hedge fund days.
